HawthorneVillager.com

[Jenn&Amar]

Hey, does anyone know what the proper clearance requirement is between a 3 piece rough-in and the electrical panel in the basement? Our 3 piece rough-in was installed right between the furnace and the electrical panel, and as a result it looks like there is not enough space to put a bathroom without putting the electrical panel in the bathroom.

During the frame walk, one of the builder's representatives said they made a big mistake, but someone else from the builder said that it is not a problem because there is enough space to build a wall in between the panel and the rough-in (so the panel would not have to be in the bathroom). Even if the builder is right about the space to build a wall, is there a requirement for the plumbing to be so many inches away from the panel?

Wouldn't it be a safety issue to have electrical that close to water in case of a leak? Our closing date is in October, do we have to move in if this is not fixed?

Any info we can get is appreciated!

Jenn & Amar

[electrician 4 u]

The answer is no you are not allowed to have an electrical panel located in a bathroom closet, water closet, broom closet, any confined room .
I am not much of a designer to provide you with a new layout on how to re design that space but , as long as it is not inside the bathroom you are safe.
Good luck

[electrician 4 u]

as long as there is a demising wall separating the bathroom to the panel it is considered safe.
normally there is a min requirement of 1.5 meters from any outlet/device to a wet location it could be as low as 1 meter given the device is gfci pretected. in this case you are located on the other side of the wall which in my opinion makes it safe. if you are still worried call the electrical safety authority 1 800 esa safe. they do all the inspections and would give you good advise.

[R&N]

Incorrect panel placement ranks as a colossal screw up to me. Electrical panels cannot be located in coal bins, stairwells, bathrooms or closets. Arc flash rules state no barriers within 1 meter of a panel. Officially you need: 1m clearance in front of the panel, 2m of head room and 1m horizontal space but the panel does not have to be centered within that horizontal area. If this isn't met or they give you any flak at all, pull out your cell phone and call the city or ESA to request an inspection urgently.



What that means in practice is that you should bring a tape measure and some masking tape and mark the floor based on the drawing above. Any walls you put up in the basement must be at least this far away from the panel. If this impedes your rough-in, then you're going to need to re-think any basement bathroom plans or have them move something.

There are actually few specific rules regarding the placement of plumbing lines near a panel. However, there is a rule that states that non-electrical equipment cannot be installed or placed so close to electrical equipment as to create a condition which is dangerous. So, if you have a plumbing line or a junction directly above your panel and condensation or a leak is possible, then inspectors make a judgement call.

A good source of free info on electrical code for consumers is here:
http://www.esasafe.com/faqs.htm

[electrician 4 u]

this is the reason i sugested to call esa. They can make the descision if the wall that separates the panel to the washroom to be deemed safe. If you call esa and ask for a site inpection they would be better served to make a descision for you. 1 800 esa safe

[R&N]

[Jenn&Amar]

Thanks everyone!

[Roxy]

If Mattamy refuses to move it you may be stuck having to do the rough in a second time on your own dime no? Now that the ESA is involved, you may be liable if you ignore their recomendation.

[Jenn&Amar]

[Roxy]

Getting them to redo a rough in is probably going to be a tough one. Sometimes they wont even switch dryer and washer outlets in a laundry room. lol

[Jenn&Amar]

[kf095]

It looks like we have similar problem.
Paid for rough-in in the basement.
This is how it was done.
Walnut house model.


Wall will be 0.5 m from the panel maximum.
I asked our builder team representative, he promised to check and never did anything.
Yesterday we have another Mattamy guy to follow up after closing before 30 days list.
He told us it is fine.
I went to this site, which was mentioned.
http://www.esasafe.com/faqs.htm
Could not find the bulleting document with picture listed above.
How do I prove to Mattamy what they did it wrong without document?

[balsyan]

hmmmmmmmmmmmm........get jack hammering and move those rough ins away from the electrical panel. Have fun trying to get someone to come and sort this mess out.

Now i really wonder how most of the things pass planning permission. They probably have someones uncle working at the city of milton who doesnt even know how to read drawings. Believe me i have a similar problem with 1st floor ductwork, and when i questioned it after i found the problem when i finished painting the hallway, i was told it was built to code. In actual sense they were cost saving by not burying sheet metal ductwork for a return air grille. Hence the carpet in that area is going black from the dust being sucked through the wall.

I feel for us all. We got taken for a ride.
_________________
Bal Syan

[R&N]

If that rough-in drain is within 1m of the panel, then I'd very clearly express your concerns in writing to Mattamy and request a written reply that addresses their compliance with Rules 2-308 and 2-310 of the Ontario/Canadian Electrical Safety Code. The Milton public library has a copy of the Canadian Electrical Code where you can lookup the above rules. This issue is specifically addressed in ESA bulletin 2-9-3 as I've shown in the image in my previous post.

If the rough-in drain is just outside of 1m of the panel then you can put it in a 2x3 framed wall and, technically, still maintain a 1m clearance so it meets code. That doesn't mean it is easy to come up with a useful floor plan, but keep in mind that the tub/shower does not strictly need to be directly above the rough-in. A plumber has a fair bit of flexibility in pitching the pipe to the rough-in location. If it were me, I'd stomp my feet and make enough noise to have the shower drain moved.

[BuildingHomes.ca]