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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 3:54 pm 
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Location: HVE
While neither a proponent or opponent, that article has one problem with it, in that the scientist quoted says there is a net energy loss ... by the time he factors it all the way back to the raw materials stage.

Now, if we didn't have the raw materials through usage stages, we wouldn't have any garbage at all and none of this would be necessary, those are sunk costs that have nothing to do with considering the options of disposing of garbage. Basically, once someone puts it out on the curb, the options are recycle it, pile it up, or burn it, none of which are even energy positive from this point if you count the energy used in the manufacturing of the disposal distribution systems, the fuel used to transport it, etc... but we don't want the garbage building up in our homes, so we need some form of distribution.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for getting informed and making your decision, but to do that you need to compare apples and apples. Nowhere have I seen anywhere near enough information to make a reasonable decision, so my rule of thumb come the election is "as far away as possible without intruding on someone else".

That's why I personally am leaning for the waste facility since it is far down 25, while I am very against the Pristine Power facility because of how close it is to a number of subdivisions.

Steve.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 3:59 pm 
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Steve Heath wrote:
While neither a proponent or opponent, that article has one problem with it, in that the scientist quoted says there is a net energy loss ... by the time he factors it all the way back to the raw materials stage.

Now, if we didn't have the raw materials through usage stages, we wouldn't have any garbage at all and none of this would be necessary, those are sunk costs that have nothing to do with considering the options of disposing of garbage. Basically, once someone puts it out on the curb, the options are recycle it, pile it up, or burn it, none of which are even energy positive from this point if you count the energy used in the manufacturing of the disposal distribution systems, the fuel used to transport it, etc... but we don't want the garbage building up in our homes, so we need some form of distribution.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for getting informed and making your decision, but to do that you need to compare apples and apples. Nowhere have I seen anywhere near enough information to make a reasonable decision, so my rule of thumb come the election is "as far away as possible without intruding on someone else".

That's why I personally am leaning for the waste facility since it is far down 25, while I am very against the Pristine Power facility because of how close it is to a number of subdivisions.

Steve.


In general, the laws of physics say that there is no energy psitive process. Every process has a net energy loss. It is as simple as that.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 10:26 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 01, 2004 5:46 am
Posts: 4498
Location: Tothburg, Winter Cres.
NewtoMilton wrote:
QweenB wrote:
there is a heading that quotes "retiring" Regional Chair Joyce Savoline as saying that 89% of those polled, approve of a EFW facility.
First, I would wonder how this poll was conducted


So Joyce's numbers are WRONG and yours are RIGHT? Who should we beleive?
The recent poll that was quoted in the Champion was from Decima which is a reputable large polling company. But the wording of the poll wasn't if you approve of a EFW facility next door to your house.. it was more if you thought the technology around EFW would be successful. Remember the wording of a poll will greatly affect the results.

There have been various articles on this poll in different media outlets. For example here's a recent one from the Toronto Star that also quotes Halton's result of 89% (you have to scroll down through the article)

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Conten ... 8332188492

The Star wrote:
Respondents were asked if they think the technology "will prove successful and a good way to reduce garbage and create electricity, or will prove a failure and create emissions that are harmful?"

Ninety-one per cent of GTA residents polled said they think the technology will prove successful. The number was the same in Toronto, while it rose to 94 per cent in Durham and Peel. But it was slightly lower in York and Halton at 89 per cent.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 6:03 pm 
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Location: MILTON
there are alot more cleaner forms of energy....why from waste....?
serves no purpose but to increase green house gases


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