HawthorneVillager.com

Not sure...
I think it's always advantage developer due to the serious case of 'briefcase-full-of-money' syndrome.

I heard there was some young guy in a cheap suit, who gave a bunch of good arguments against the zoning change but then said "Uh, we are a room full of smart people that will be able to handle the issues when they come up in the future, so I approve this request"
He clearly lost all credibility with his oxymoronic speech and conclusion. I wonder if somebody bought him that suit?

I'd hate to think that he's our only "YOUNG VOICE" on council. We don't need a guy that thinks he's a cool politician.. wow, another oxymoron.

By the way, great participation and discussion..

If I'm not mistaken the approval to proceed further only allows them to carry on and prepare various impact reposts etc. which are then presented at a future meeting. It does not necessarily mean the project has been given a green light to go ahead.

I coul dbe wrong, Colin would be able to answer that I'm sure. If this is the case is it really terrible that it has passed this round? Prob. not, Colin may have voted yes but all that does is give us more information to come on how the proposed daycare etc. will affect us and the neighbourhood.

Let's be careful before we go jumping down Colins throat for voting yes (if he did indeed do that). We all need more information before we would be able to make an informed decision. The daycare (if built) will affect us all differantly. Traffic would prob. be an issue for us all in the area, but people who live across the road from the site would have much greater issue then those of us elsewhere....

Colin, fill us in on last night if you could (your vote is your business, share or dont share it's okay with me!)

Hi everyone

Yes I voted to RECEIVE the application which now has to go through a technical report by staff with other agencies such as the Region, Police, Conservation Authority, Fire Department and others who would have an interest in the change of use on the property.

Thanks to everyone who came to the meeting and the six people who spoke, your comments and concerns now become part of the report which staff have to investigate and report back with their recommendations in a few months.

If you were not able to attend or sign the register, please call the Planning Department at 905-878-7252 and ask for Maria Smith who is the planner in charge of the application so you can be informed of future meetings and be involved in the process.

Three areas of concern on my part.

1. The presentation from the lawyer from the Phase 1B area demanding compensation for the application's share in the development of the area. This was not in the report and councillors only got a copy of the letter at the meeting. I do not believe the applicants know about this and the cost could be in the ten's of thousands of dollars for their share in roads, water, sewers and parks etc. This alone may stop the application in terms of costs and legal fees.

2. The applicants, their agent and the proposed operators did not show up or make a presentation which is not only unusual it is also disrespectful of you the neighbours, Council and staff. Typically the applicant or their agent is the first to speak after the staff person has made their presentation.

Also in not being able to hear and respond to the concerns of presenters and councillors creates further doubts in everyone's minds.

3. The application has already changed three times since the submission last month. One to modify the type of use from commercial to institutional, second the change in the parking area which may help the application, the third the increase the number of day care spaces from 80 to 98 children which was only announced at the meeting concerns other councillors and I.

If these and other issues are not resolved and the applicants and operators do not show that they are concerned about their neighbourhood I WILL NOT BE SUPPORTING this application as I am also disappointed in the lack of professionalism in the application.

As Councillor Lunau pointed out at the meeting the initial meeting is something council has to go through or the applicants could appeal directly to the Ontario Municipal Board (OMB) where they could be approved as the application does meet some Town and Provincial requirements.

I will let everyone know when the application come back to Council for the Technical Report. If you did not make a presentation last night you might also want to let your ward councillors know of your concerns as Councillor Day could not make the meeting due to vacation plans.

Colin Best
Local & Regional Councillor
Wards 2 & 4
Milton/Halton

Let me just say that I am ALL for development, but I'm sick of having Milton contiune the ol' cart before the horse routine.

How can ANY of this stuff even pass the first stage when the town doesn't even OWN the land yet to expand JSP south, which will supposedly take on all the traffic?
"We're close to working it out", they say, but that means absolutely nothing to me.
Before any zoning change applications are even considered in this area, we need commitment from the Town to (a) Complete JSP by __ date, (b) reduce the speed limit of 4th line to 30km/h, (c) install speed humps on 4th line to REALLY deter people from driving on it, and (d) commit to disallowing any parking or stopping of any kind between 8am-6pm on BOTH sides of the road. Without these commitments, how can there be any consideration to even allowing applications for zoning changes?

I am absolutely sick of seeing development preceed infrastructure. I have trust that Colin will represent us well when all of the studies are complete and the application to rezone is under review.

Colin,

First allow me to thank you for your response. You availability on this site is a huge assest to the community, and very much appreciated. I beleive you are the only member of council that posts here, and you do so reguarly. So thank you!

But......with all that being said, I have to say I'm very dissapointed to read your post on what happened last night. (I'm trying to word this as respectfully as I can.)

Your post listed some very legitimate, and strong doubts in the initial request to move forward on the zone change application.

Yet you voted to proceed? I don't understand why.

You mentioned 6 people spoke out against the application at the meeting last night, and none for it - but you still voted to proceed.

I know you were not alone in voting yes, but if an application falls that short in your eyes, and after hearing how the residents feel about it - it should have stopped right there.

If it does get rejected and the applicants move on to the OMB, then we'll deal that when it happens. Fear of litigation should not be a reason to carry the motion on.

Do you know what the actual count was on the vote? Was it 4-2 as mentioned? If it was 3-3 would the motion have been stopped?

It's a shame to think it could have been stopped last night, instead of giving the developer a chance to reload, and sending them onto the next step. Each step they move along will make it harder and harder to stop.

If council is being short sited there are other LEGAL methods that can be used to "influence" change.

Hypothetical example:

In Canada it is LEGAL for women to walk around in public TOPLESS. Wouldn't it be a shame if the route lead them down forth line in front of the day care say between 8 and 830am and 430-5pm. As much as anyone may object, it is there legal right to do so. I hope the parents who drop their kids off at the day care enjoy the show and approve of their children being witness to it.

In europe this is common place for women to be topless, here some find it offensive, but as long as it is legal...

Just an idea

I am not one to defend them, but council didn't do anything wrong here. Given the overall official plan for the town / region and the need for day care spaces they politically can not summarily deny the application without letting the applicants make a full submission.

Once all the facts are in they will be in a position to make an informed decision on this case. Like it or not everyone should have a fair chance to both apply, and oppose re-zoning on their lands. The OMB is not fond of finding in favor of municipalities who do not follow the proper procedures in re-zoning issues... and each fight taken to the OMB can run into the hundreds of thousands of dollars (our taxes at work) so anything that they can do to lower the chances of having to go to the OMB, or to improve their case before they get there are to be applauded.

I wasn't at the meeting, but I suspect that at least one (or both) opposition votes were political grand-standing since it is almost a forgone conclusion in this case that council had to vote to let the application be made. It is fairly normal political tactics to vote to oppose something that you know will go through.... its a win - win most times as to one group you can claim that you were part of the council who got them what they wanted... while the opposing group can be told that you were the one person in there fighting for them .

This doesn't mean that they are any closer (really) to getting the zoning they have requested, just that they are being allowed to go through the proper process.

Just my thoughts.

Thanks Marc

To answer a few of the questions posted so far.

- The High School site is to be located at the south-east corner of 4th Line and Louis St. Laurent Blvd. (check hdsb.ca school information) for a scheduled September 2010 opening to serve the local area with another high school to open in the Sherwood Survey nearer Tremaine Road later when the numbers warrant construction.

- By my count the Initial Report was received by a 6-2 vote as the Mayor only votes in the event of a tie and Councillors Day and Boughton were away.

From what I saw, this is the vote break down

For : Best, Schau, Penman, Nelson, Lunau and Lee.

Against : Mowbray and Scherer.

You can check this on the COGECO TV channel this and the next 3 Wednesdays at 8 pm. which will air the 3+ hour council meeting including the 40,000 + resident area Boyne Survey which is projected to start in 2012 south of Louis St. Laurent Blvd. with the Bowes neighbourhood directly south on 4th Line between James Snow Parkway and Thompson road to have about 10,000 people in 3000 homes with about 6000 cars.

Check hdsb.ca under milton school boundaries maps which already includes drawing of proposed streets off 4th Line before council has even started the Secondary Plan which takes about a year to study.

- The Region has now acquired all the land necessary for the extention of James Snow Parkway south to Britannia Road as stated by John Brophy the acting Engineering Director than night.

- The technical report process for this type of existing building application takes about 3-6 months to study with the staff notifiying everyone involved who signed in at the meeting when the next meetings which involve the Technical Report and Site Plan with council and staff review.

Also is case anyone misses the signs and ads in the papers 4th line will be CLOSED FOR CONSTRUCTION between August 5th and September 12th between Beaty Trail and the Union Gas line easement to allow for the construction of utilitiy lines and a new road as part of the Summerwood Estates subdivision at the south-west corner of 4th Line and Derry road and includes the extension of Ferguson Ave. north and west to connect up with Armstrong Blvd. and a new intersection just west of 4th line at Derry road including traffic lights in 2009 for both developments north and south of Derry Road.

Please note the detour routes in the papers and temporary detour signs that will be posted.

Colin Best
Local & regional councillor
Wards 2 & 4
Milton/Halton